that censorships censorship helps to
keep the population happy which is quite
a statement for the media program of
Conrad adenovo foundation and I would
argue against that I don't believe that
I believe that censorship is maybe in
order for a majority of the people but
if you think about the minorities if you
think about the wiggurus if you think
about the metoo activists they suffer
from censorship that's the one side the
other side is that censorship also
prevents a very important function of
the media which is to help
accountability to make sure that the
government is accountable so my question
to you is if you say the censorship is
fine where does accountability come from
for the Chinese government for Xi
Jinping and his government because at
least I believe that this is a very
important mechanism in a country that
there's accountability for the
government
maybe you don't think that's true but
I'm really interested in your
perspective on that
you know one one thing I love about the
English language is its precision
so
when I said
that censorship
has not prevented the Chinese people
from becoming happy
it doesn't mean that censorship has made
the Chinese people happy
these are two very different statements
okay
it is true that there is censorship in
China
it's also true that there's a lot of
happiness in China that's that's the
reality that I'm describing now I would
prefer like you to live in a society
without censorship certainly
but that's the choice you want that's a
choice I want
that the Chinese people choose what they
want
and when you ask for accountability
I suggest you look at four thousand
years of Chinese history
when the emperor
fails
right
he loses the mandator of Heaven
and in one way or another
the Chinese people
have overthrown bad Emperors for four
thousand years right they've suffered
from time to time which is true
and if you look at the cycles of Chinese
civilization all I'm saying is you want
to understand China why don't you look
at Chinese history okay
now the Chinese go through Cycles right
when they have bad years they have 200
bad years
guess what the Chinese have just had
almost 200 bad years
now the Chinese are beginning
200 good years
of which 40 years have just happened
and whether or not there is censorship
or no censorship
another 160 good years are coming
that's the reality
I'm not saying I approve of it
I'm saying censorship is not going to
make a difference right because the
Chinese have evolved their own social
and political contract
you may not like it I may not like it
but they seem to like it and I want to
emphasize a key point
it's a bit arrogant for westerners to
tell the Chinese people
we know better than you do what is good
for you and in this book I cite an
American ambassador Chaz Freeman he says
we in the west don't understand
that China suffers a ratio of people to
arable land which is among the tightest
in the world
if the United States had the same ratio
of people to arable land as China does
United States wouldn't have 330 million
people
United States would have 4 billion
people
and Chas Friedman says if we in America
if we had 4 billion people
we would accept far more controls and
restrictions than we do today because
when you're crowded living together you
accept a social contract which is much
tighter and more disciplined than
Americans will accept so we're I'm not
suggesting we should become like the
Chinese I agree with Stefan right
we should look out after ourselves we
should create our own societies
China is not asking us to transform
ourselves
all that China is saying is our society
is good for ourselves you keep your
society and we live and work with each
other I think that's a perfectly
reasonable statement
