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Democracy, Tyranny, and Chaos(ZT)

(2007-06-18 23:33:35) 下一個
Democracy, Tyranny, and Chaos.

送交者: gd2 2005年6月08日19:18:33 於 [兒童成長]http://www.bbsland.com
回 答: 嗅覺很靈敏,indeed,沒有的味道都能聞出來 :) 由 c1a2n3a 於 2005年6月08日18:05:29:



The D state does not last forever, nor the other two.

US is likely: D-> T-> C...
and China likely: T-> C-> D...

We had a discussion here a yr or so ago.

Or read "The Republic". :-)
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補充一點(慎入,很枯燥)

送交者: goodparent 2005年6月09日05:31:46 於 [兒童成長]http://www.bbsland.com
回 答: 解釋一下 由 goodparent 於 2005年6月09日04:17:42:



根據Plato的理論,每個國家或者地區都不可能在一種製度(民主,專製,或者混亂)下長久存在,因為每個製度都有其致命弱點。結果是每個國家都不斷地在一個環路中轉來轉去。

用gd2 的話來說,美國的循環途徑好像是 D-> T-> C-> D-> T-> C-> D-> T-> C-> ... 而中國的循環途徑好像是 T-> C-> D-> T-> C-> D-> T-> C-> D-> ...

就我自己來看,現在美國的民主政治和自由競爭的市場經濟都有很多弊端,因為當初建國立憲的時候留下太多漏洞。由於這些弊端,將來美國的經濟將崩潰,政治將分化,國家將經曆一場血戰,重新立憲。我認為這是不可避免的。對於美國是否會進入一個專製時代,然後進入混亂,我還沒有把握。

由於中國現在還是一團糟,政治和經濟體係都很不健全,我們可以認為她是處於混亂狀態。在這一點上,我跟gd2的觀點相同。

中國的民主化是毫無疑問的,肯定要發生。但是,我希望它慢慢地發生,因為我希望中國人看到先行者美國開始走下坡的初步結果,以便從中汲取教訓,把中國的立憲工作做得比美國更先進,更全麵,更合理。
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The three states don't have to repeat exactly.

送交者: gd2 2005年6月09日06:39:50 於 [兒童成長]http://www.bbsland.com
回 答: 補充一點(慎入,很枯燥) 由 goodparent 於 2005年6月09日05:31:46:



China has been in T&C cycling for thousands of yrs, without D.

China 1911-1949 was in Chaos, and from 1949 to now in Tyranny(--not back in Chaos yet).
Did someone dispute this with me last yr already?

Even if a Democracy state were established perfectly, it would still eventually die.
Plato didn't say it clearly in his work, but he did all the proof leading to the only
logical conclusion. ("When has any philosopher ever said anything clearly?")

What US is going into next has little scholastic value(it's a pain anyway!). But it has
a lot to do with how a man is to struggle to preserve his family's wealth and life, especially for Chinese
Americans and ABC kids.

As the New "New Deal" seems increasingly likely since my writing last yr, Tyranny is more
likely the state the US is getting into next.

Have a nice day!
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